| Author |
Message |
Ccs
Username: Ccs
Registered: 03-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 18, 2006 - 3:08 pm: | |
I was looking at a RG320DXQM this afternoon and when I went to check the serial I noticed that under the model deignation,where the "built in" and serial are,was cover with a sticker with a serial number and also on the back of the headstock,stamped/pressed was the word USED and a little further down a letter S.
I've never seen this before.
I really have no interest in the guitar but I'm curious about the meaning.I assume it's basicly the same as a "second" as you see with some older Gibsons but what makes a used instrument coming from the factory?Was it sent out as a demo piece?
It seems funny after all these years it's the first one I've seen stamped this way. |
Mr_roadstar
Username: Mr_roadstar
Registered: 06-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 18, 2006 - 4:18 pm: | |
Often with factory second merchandise, the "Used" stamp is placed on the instrument for legal reasons. Anything other than factory fresh items are to be represented as "Used" by law. The "S" by itself does not clearly indicate to the consumer that he is looking a "Second". Everybody comprehends "Used".
This is obviously a selective enforcement thing as most of what GC has on the wall looks "Used" to me...
Steve |
Ibanezfreak1960
Username: Ibanezfreak1960
Registered: 03-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 18, 2006 - 11:24 pm: | |
HoshinoUSA stamps the S on there seconds. I've never seen one stamped "used" from there but have seen it on some ebay auctions. Maybe they are from Chesbro. I don't know for sure.
And Steve I agree about GC. I could never understand how they could call any of their stuff NEW after all of the abuse it goes through. |
Brentm
Username: Brentm
Registered: 03-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 18, 2006 - 11:36 pm: | |
It's the same way a dealer can put 3000 miles on a car and sell it as new because it has never been titled. It's just a loophole. |
Jeffsailor
Username: Jeffsailor
Registered: 01-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 19, 2006 - 10:00 am: | |
The "Used" stamp on the headstock voids any factory warranty.
js |
Ccs
Username: Ccs
Registered: 03-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 19, 2006 - 1:27 pm: | |
Okay,that all makes sense.
To be honest,I thought the whole seconds thing went out the window a long time ago,when inconsistance in quality became the norm.
What would cause something to be set out stamped used intead of just being scrapped or having the problem addressed?
A few Gibson seconds I've had were all due to finish flaws(that no one would think twice about by todays standards)and from what I understand that usually was the main reason.Anything "unsound" never left the factory.George Gruhn did a very interesting seminar on seconds a little while back. |
Mr_roadstar
Username: Mr_roadstar
Registered: 06-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 19, 2006 - 7:42 pm: | |
Too bad guitars don't have odometers...
Steve |
Jeffsailor
Username: Jeffsailor
Registered: 01-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 19, 2006 - 8:24 pm: | |
Most factory seconds have nothing wrong with them other than simple finish flaws, but without knowing for sure, its simply something that I wouldn't get involved with.
There are a ton of people selling factory seconds on eBay and most don't disclose the fact they're seconds. I've developed a habit of always asking if the back of the headstock is stamped "USED" before pursuing a new guitar.
js |
Ibanezfreak1960
Username: Ibanezfreak1960
Registered: 03-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, April 20, 2006 - 3:29 pm: | |
Here is an example of Hoshino USA current 2nd stamp. It is a S.
In the 70's they stamped a 2 on the headstock. On the bolt on models they stamped the neck plate. |
Ibanezfreak1960
Username: Ibanezfreak1960
Registered: 03-2004
| | Posted on Friday, April 21, 2006 - 11:39 am: | |
I emailed one of my contacts at hoshinoUSA about the USED stamp and here is his reply,
Brian,
Here's the answer I got from our repair shop. I concur. I've never seen anything stamped by us as USED.
Hi Paul, all guitars are stamped S for 2nds.I've never been aware of anything being stamped USED.
Paul |
Jeffsailor
Username: Jeffsailor
Registered: 01-2004
| | Posted on Friday, April 21, 2006 - 1:39 pm: | |
Brian,
Take a look at this auction:
http://www.qksrv.net/click-1802666-10381315?loc=http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll%3FViewItem%26item%3D7402650454
and here's the picture of the back of the headstock. Someone is stamping these...
 |
Mrmike
Username: Mrmike
Registered: 01-2006
| | Posted on Friday, April 21, 2006 - 5:33 pm: | |
M.I.R.C. is a large wholesaler of gtrs.They buy closeouts,discontinued,and seconds from a lot of different manufacturers.They DO stamp 'USED' on the guitars they sell.
If I have a gtr in my store stamped USED,I tell people it means U.S.EDition. Old music store joke.... |
Ibanezfreak1960
Username: Ibanezfreak1960
Registered: 03-2004
| | Posted on Friday, April 21, 2006 - 5:50 pm: | |
Jeff I think it is the seller is stamping these to free them of waranty like you said earlier. But I had a 2nd acoustic from Hoshino and they took it in and fixed it for me and honored the warranty. They usually are finish flaws or minor issues that don't affect the playability of the guitar. If you look on the pic above it already has Hoshino's S stamped between the two E tuners. |
Jeffsailor
Username: Jeffsailor
Registered: 01-2004
| | Posted on Friday, April 21, 2006 - 6:00 pm: | |
No, its not the seller. There are a ton of different people that are selling these "stamped" guitars. And since most go out of their way not to disclose the fact that they're stamped, it doesn't make any sense that they're the ones doing it.
js |
Jeffsailor
Username: Jeffsailor
Registered: 01-2004
| | Posted on Friday, April 21, 2006 - 6:06 pm: | |
Although I will get on board with the idea that perhaps a wholesale dealer is doing it and all these eBay sellers happen to be getting their stock from the same supply chain. I would think Hoshino would be able to confirm that they sell a bulk of their seconds to a select few wholesale distributors.
js |
Ibanezfreak1960
Username: Ibanezfreak1960
Registered: 03-2004
| | Posted on Friday, April 21, 2006 - 6:12 pm: | |
Well when I asked my contact about it I mentioned the ebay guitars and asked if they stamped the bulk 2nds that way and the reply is above. Every guitar that goes through HoshinoUSA is inspected set up and reboxed. If it has a flaw or damage it then goes to the repair shop who in turn checks it out and does the 2nd stamp on it. I have never seen a Prestige on the seconds list and I get them quite often. I guess they get repaired. Maybe this is Chesbro'd way of identifying a second but why the "Used" and an S?
By the way a Vintage Ibanez like I said above will have a 2 not a S stamped on it.
Brian |
Jeffsailor
Username: Jeffsailor
Registered: 01-2004
| | Posted on Friday, April 21, 2006 - 8:22 pm: | |
Yeah, I have an old concord 12 string that is a stamped second and it has a "2" on the back of the headstock.
I have only seen the "USED" stamp on acoustics. I wonder if is these are indeed being stamped at the factory and then sold directly to wholesale distributors, by-passing Hoshino altogether. That would explain why there's no warranty.
js |
Ibanezfreak1960
Username: Ibanezfreak1960
Registered: 03-2004
| | Posted on Friday, April 21, 2006 - 9:57 pm: | |
MIRC is one hoshino's customers. I remember during the holidays in december I ordered a 2nd Artcore and someone had shipped the whole lot of seconds to them and they had to cancel my order and everyone elses.There were a few pissed off poeple to say the least.
You gotta remember the acoustic you pictured has the S on it also. |
Ccs
Username: Ccs
Registered: 3-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, February 15, 2007 - 11:16 am: | |
Well surprise suprise,the same one I started this thread about just came in for some work.
I see a finish blem under the topcoat on the inside of one horn so that is probably why it's a second.
Also the bridge pup poles don't line up with the strings. |