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Author Message   Chris Posted on Friday, October 08, 2004 - 11:04 am:    Hi guys i just wanted to ask would it be wrong of me to ask you people if you ahve delt with someone over the internet and your experience of buying from them? just want to know because im buying a guitar and i just want some feed back thanks a million chris   JohnS Posted on Friday, October 08, 2004 - 11:04 am:    Chris: I've wondered about this myself. The following is my opinion (not legal advice) and is the "official policy" that I'll go by in making decisions to delete any messages that I feel are not in the best interests of this discussion area. This policy is subject to change...if my opinion should change. J My feeling is that a business could/should be held to a higher degree of scrutiny and public criticism than a private party. I say this because, I feel that if you open a business then it is the BUSINESS OWNER'S responsibility to build and protect a favorable reputation in the marketplace. This may come at a higher price than anticipated. That's because there are many jerk buyers out there. But a "professional" needs to bend over backward to show he's acting in good faith. Or institute very stringent guidelines for a sale. This step can weed out a lot of jerks. Hey, being in business for yourself is not a picnic. When you are dealing with a private party, such an expectation of professional behavior should NOT be relied upon. If you want assurances, guarantees, secure payments, shipping insurance, etc, etc., etc., it's just as much your responsibilty as the other party's to negotiate these. If you get burned, it's your lesson learned for the next time. Regarding complaints: If it is absolutely apparent that all efforts to work things out with an obstinent "professional" fail, then word of mouth is the only way to "get satisfaction". For the "professional", word of mouth is a two edged sword. For the consumer, it's often the only way to level the playing field. Regarding raves: This is the reward of being a good business person. They are justified and should be encouraged. And if you post a favorable message about a person you've done business with and someone doesn't agree with you. Don't go ballistic because they tell you so, in front of the entire Internet. That's the responsibility YOU have to take for exercising YOUR freedom of expression. Regarding Your Responibility: But in any case, extreme care should be given to anything you say in public. You may not think so, but you might be held legally responsible for libel or slander because you chose to express your opinion publicly. What's this forum's policy?: If someone posts a message that is extremely volatile, I may remove it and check the circumstances behind the problem. I WILL take into account whether the parties are "professionals". And it's totally up to me whether I will repost the original message or suggest a different way to make the intent known to the forum users. This is because I am also at risk, legally. And I won't take that lightly when making any decisions. If there are any forum users who think my policy is too heavey-handed or ambiguous...start your own discussion forum and do things your way. Better safe than sorry: When asking for references, you could ask that all responses be sent to your private email address. Chris, sorry this reply is so long, but it's for everyone's benefit. JohnS ICW   Chris Posted on Friday, October 08, 2004 - 11:04 am:    ok im not here to post any negative feedback so here is what the deal is we were originally going to do this for cod but since i live in canada i cant then i said well i can wire you the money when i get the guitar because that alot of money for me or anyone to lose so then we got to iescrow this is the offer i made to him ill opay the money we agreed the money for shipping we agreed and the 5% iescrow asks of the seller just so we could use iescrow and he said no............seesm a little fishy to me so i dunno what to do........and.....what if he doesnt send me my shipping money back? Chris   Chris Posted on Friday, October 08, 2004 - 11:04 am:    ok delete that last message john i didnt read yours........i dont want to sound like im raggin..so..ill just email privatly...sorry chris   JohnS Posted on Friday, October 08, 2004 - 11:04 am:    Chris: Being that you aren't using any names, it really doesn't matter. The cirscumstances you present aren't clear to me. Why can't you accept COD in Canada? UPS is worldwide, no? If you agree to pay shipping (to you) and pay the shipping to send it back (if your not satisfied) AND agree to pay Iescrow's fee, then I can't understand the seller would not go for it.   Chris Posted on Friday, October 08, 2004 - 11:04 am:    i dont know why they dont accept COD's in canada from america but they just dont? and i have no idea why hes not accepting this deal..hes not loosing any money at all this just baffels me to no end and i promised him i would not screw him over and i gave him two email addresses fo two previous people i have delt with and done flawless business with........im just really out of ideas i really want this guitar too its my fave guitar and i just really want it..........so...... i dunno chris   jimeina Posted on Friday, October 08, 2004 - 11:04 am:    I live in Canada and deal with lots of people in the States. COD's impossible so I ALWAYS prepay. If you can get some decent net references from the person you're dealing with (and you check them!), you probably won't have a problem, but I always follow two simple rules of thumb (and I've never been ripped off): 1. ALWAYS talk to the person you are buying from by phone before you finalize the deal. Spend some time with him, ask him specific questions about the instrument, and get a clear agreement on packaging and shipping. Follow up with an email confirming the conversation and what was agreed upon and don't send anything until you get a response. 2. NEVER go for a deal - no matter how badly you want it - if it doesn't "feel" right after talking to the person. "Use the Force" ie: Trust your instincts. Most net traders and sellers are good, honest people like yourself, looking to move some equipment that is difficult to sell locally (I know what that's like!). If something seems wrong with the deal, it probabaly is. Better safe than sorry. jim   rich harris Posted on Friday, October 08, 2004 - 11:04 am:    I have had nothing but pleasurable experiences buying and selling on the net UNTIL i ran into a guy that was advertising NOS painted satriani models and paul stanley models. my instincts told me something was not right, he would not do cod, would not do escrow (by the way, check out www.dealsafe.com for escrow, $20 straight fee per deal) and just came off like too smooth a talker. I checked him out with a dealer he had mentioned while talking and that night had him pegged as using 2 different names and 3 different email addresses all tied to the same cell phone # i had called him on. not being able to resist the posibility it was legit, i sent my postal money orders (his request) to an online friend in la to do an in person deal for me. of course he just kept making excuses and a deal never happened [including the "they were stolen along with my 500 SL from lax parking" (lapd says no)] expenses including alot of phone calls cost me around $250 but at least i didn't get burned, BUT he did burn another online friend of mine from michigan for $2500. he is using addresses in venice and beverly hills and at this time I have him as 5 different names and 6 different email addresses and 2 phone #'s. When i send payment to someone, i want all the contact info i can get, home # and address, work # and name of employer, and i make sure to call both and verify the information. NEVER send payments to a P.O. box or PMB (postal mail box) and be suspicious of a cheap rental address like "suite 107 bla bla". also be wary of a throw away email address like aol or hotmail. ask for online feedback such as that at ebay.com, or references from past deals, but be wary if all the references are from hotmail accounts too. BOTTOM LINE, do your homework, use you instincts, and follow these guidelines. 99% of the people you come in contact with on the net are honest and are not looking to screw you, unfortunately it only takes that 1% to ruin a good thing. And some of you guys make it just too easy for these con artists. I broker ibanez and some of you will just write and say "give me your address and i'll send you a bank check" and i have to say "NO, first go to ebay and check my feedback, then, here is my phone #, call me to verify and we can go from there". It seems like almost every deal i do, i am educating the other party as to what is a "safe" way to trade on the net. JUST BE CAREFUL. my 2 cents, rich harris   Chris Posted on Friday, October 08, 2004 - 11:04 am:    Hi guys thanks for the responses...but now the guy wants to do it thorugh ebay ....i told him i wanted my shipping money back and he said ok..lets do it through ebay so its all good now thanks again and thanks to you.......you know who you are Chris   JohnS Posted on Friday, October 08, 2004 - 11:04 am:    Chris: You didn't mention what guitar it is that you're after...maybe you think we'll buy it out from under you. J Anyway, once it's safely in your collection let us know what you got. I think this thread helped many to become "wise" Internet shoppers. Rich: Thanks for your up-front advice and experiences. I have to add that every seller I've bought from has called "me" when I requested a phone chat to solidify the deal. They did so even though "I" volunteered to make the call, if it was more convenient. The fact that each seller took the time, and spent his own dime, boosted my confidence in their intergrity. JohnS ICW   Chris Posted on Friday, October 08, 2004 - 11:04 am:    WOOOOOOOOOPS why the hell did i say ebay i ment iescrow........im such an idiot...i cant believe i said ebay twice..WOOPS ok me and the guy are going through Iescrow not ebay like i said before...damn im an idiot ./...i cant believe i didnt notice that its a S540LTD from ,93 its a killer guitar Chris   JohnS Posted on Friday, October 08, 2004 - 11:04 am:    Sounds great. What color? (Upload some pictures of it, if you can.) I really like the looks of the 540 Burl Mahogany and flame Maple tops. I've never played and S. What's it like?   Chris Posted on Friday, October 08, 2004 - 11:04 am:    its a reddish marron colour i dont have pics of it yet but i can put up a pic of what it will look like i love those custom prestiege S's im in the works on gettin me one of those soon and im having frank falbo make me a custom S well the body is a stock S470 flame top but hes making me the custom 24 fret neck ill deffinatly have pics of that up and specs....its going to be amazing i think the S is the best guitar..its so nicely shaped it fits with your body and the tone..oh my god..the tone is un believable if you have the right pickups in it...you ahve the best combination with Dimarzios for sure because the body is mahogany it has a sweeter and fatter tone than the jems or rgs........it has brightness too....its just unbelievable check one out...... Chris

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