JP20: is that pickup REALLY offset?

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Author Message Petruz Username: Petruz Registered: 05-2004 Posted on Friday, September 23, 2005 - 6:34 am:    One of the most fascinating Ibanezes for me is the JP20. Maybe because in the early 80's I had the opportunity to see him sporting one (an incredible duet with Oscar Peterson in Rio de Janeiro) and, since then, the Ibanez light sparkled in my head... In the catalogues this "offset pickup" feature is highlited, so as it was a real improvement of the "traditional" jazztone. They clamed the JP20 had "unparallelled tonal balance". I noted that the pickup poles are placed under a precise point - the G# harmonics, roughly at the 27th fret axis. Obviously one may think that Joe pass himself approved, if not suggested, this operation. Ibanez engineers took all the measurements of Joe's Acquisto archtop to develop the JP signature, but decided to move the pickup backwards. Coincidence or not, this guitar delivers precisely that dry, acoustic Pass tone typical of his very first recordings for Pablo (Virtuoso etc). But that strange pickup position may have another, much easier, explanation: as the fotos show, Joe's playing position was very unusual (see photos). He placed the guitar to the left of his body (almost falling off) and played "over" the neck; with his new Ibanez guitar his right hand plucked the strings right in the "void area" created between the fretboard and the pickup. Could this be true? Maybe Joe Pass was simply trying to "get rid" of those fastidious pickups under his nails? P. Petruz Username: Petruz Registered: 05-2004 Posted on Friday, September 23, 2005 - 6:46 am:    Errata corrige: I meant Joe placed his guitar to the right, not to the left, of his body. Guitartim Username: Guitartim Registered: 04-2001 Posted on Friday, September 23, 2005 - 11:32 am:    Great shots of Mr. Pass and his signature archtop. I've always lusted after one of those! His playing position and finger placement is how he got that gorgeous fat jazz tone. I do not know the reasoning behind the pickup placement, but you may be correct. Also the pickup looks like it is in the same area as the Gibson ES165's as well as Herb Ellis' old 175 single p'up model. Funkle Username: Funkle Registered: 12-2001 Posted on Friday, September 23, 2005 - 12:10 pm:    Petruz, you say the JP20 was a copy of Joes D'Aquisto, I always thought it was based on the FG100. Petruz Username: Petruz Registered: 05-2004 Posted on Friday, September 23, 2005 - 2:36 pm:    Funkle, I read some months ago the history behind the creation of this model, somewhere on the net... Now I just did a search but unfortunately I'm not able to find it anymore!!! In this thead there's a brief allusion to the d'Acquisto, by Marcojp: http://www.ibanezcollectors.com/discus/messages/16/6323.html?1082143414 If I find reliable info I'll post it here. In the meantime I can only assure that I did really read it... But alas: aren't the JPs older than the FGs? Petruz Username: Petruz Registered: 05-2004 Posted on Friday, September 23, 2005 - 2:44 pm:    Here's Joe playing his d'Acquisto. Note how similar the JP20 is to it, including details like pickguard and tailpiece. Petruz Username: Petruz Registered: 05-2004 Posted on Friday, September 23, 2005 - 2:46 pm:    Johns Username: Johns Registered: 02-2001 Posted on Friday, September 23, 2005 - 11:09 pm:    It appears that Joe didn't like the pickguard on his JP20. I don't see it in any of the pictures. Joevocht Username: Joevocht Registered: 08-2005 Posted on Saturday, September 24, 2005 - 12:53 am:    The reason he played so close to the neck was to get that warmer slightly muffled tone and Ibanez accomodated him by placing the pickup out of the way, but still under a harmonic. I used to have the guitar...it was awesome... Fg100 Username: Fg100 Registered: 03-2004 Posted on Wednesday, November 09, 2005 - 5:59 pm:    Ok..... Tonight I went out to buy another guitar (not Ibanez... a nylon one).. The guy selling it (a jazz guitar player... teacher) told me that Joe Pass, after a workshop in Rotterdam, said to him that Ibanez was for a long time trying to get him to "sign" a model... Joe Pass said that since he was not interested in instruments (the playing was the important thing) he didn't really care about having a signature model ... but they kept insisting and bringing him guitars (without pickups)... so one time they asked where they should put the pick up ... and he pointed ... here .... just like that... and for his surprise they showed up with the guitar with the pickup in that weird place.... The guy told me that Pass traveled with the Ibanez not to be traveling with the more expensive ones.... How does that sound to you guys? Fg100 Username: Fg100 Registered: 03-2004 Posted on Thursday, November 10, 2005 - 6:14 am:    thoughts...? Johns Username: Johns Registered: 02-2001 Posted on Thursday, November 10, 2005 - 9:55 am:    Fg100: How could one prove whether it's a correct statement or assessment of the "real" reason for the unorthodox placement of the pickup? Joe's not around to ask. If someone has written proof (articles, etc.) where Joe is quoted, that's the best way to sort it out. On one hand, it doesn't sound consistent with a great guitarist and a great guitar manufacturer. But...anything is possible. On the other hand, even if the placement was as frivilous a decision as this fellow says, it must have been a good mistake, otherwise Joe would not have continued to use the guitar and let himself be associated with it. Then again, Joe could have said it to the fellow, but was not serious...just got tired of answering (seriously) the same question for the umpteen time. Fg100 Username: Fg100 Registered: 03-2004 Posted on Thursday, November 10, 2005 - 5:15 pm:    John, I think you have a point.... and I can see a situation where Joe would be tired of answering why .. why ... why .... but I can also see a musician tired of answering how ... when ... where ... About this story, I thought I would contribute with one more and hear what you guys thought about it. Anyway, whatever way it happend... I had the chance to play on one and I liked the neck a lot. About the sound, I thought it was very beautiful and balanced. For me... well, I can imagine a guy that plays in many different instruments and decides to take the chance to try something new... Why would he want one more guitar sounding exactly like the others he already has? If he wants a 175 sound, a D'Aquisto or ...., than grab it and play, right? ... Ibanez? Now for something completely different (and beautiful nonetheless). Guitartim Username: Guitartim Registered: 04-2001 Posted on Monday, November 14, 2005 - 10:31 am:    I recall in the beginning of one of Joe Pass' instructional videos, he briefly spoke about his Ibanez signature guitar. Basically he said he was presented with the guitar by Ibanez and it was 'supposed to be a good one...' or words to that effect. He seemed ambivalent about the instrument, but played it beautifully and it sounded...well, like Joe Pass! He never came across like a gear junkie (like some of us )...Joe approached it as if it was just a good tool of his trade. Joe Pass can be seen cradling his Ibanez signature archtop on at least two of his albums as well in live and recorded performances. Like John said, he probably would not have associated himself with Ibanez and this particular guitar, wherever the pickup was placed, if it was not what he wanted. Just my observations, however. Petruz Username: Petruz Registered: 05-2004 Posted on Thursday, January 18, 2007 - 2:27 pm:    the quest continues...

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