| Author |
Message |
Jazzzbo
Username: Jazzzbo
Registered: 09-2005
| | Posted on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 12:06 pm: | |
I have just put on d'adarrio 11s, round wounds on my 2355 jazzbox and dig the sound much more than the flatwounds, now, can anyone tell me what to expect if i swap out the original metal type adjustable bridge for a wood bridge? i got a quote for around 100-150 to make this bridge and set up the guitar accordingly, any help on this very much appreciated, jazzzz |
Trickeydave
Username: Trickeydave
Registered: 08-2005
| | Posted on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 2:13 pm: | |
That seems a little steep. I recently purchased an ebony archtop bridge on eBay for $23.00 (included shipping) and had it installed on my AK85 by my luthier for $55.00. You can also find good quality ebony bridges from LMI (lmii.com) for around $15.00. Also for a little more $ you can have a custom made ebony bridge by Bill Gagnon at Gagnon Guitars (gagnonguitars.com) for $35-45.00. They are excellent quality. Hope this helps... |
Jazzzbo
Username: Jazzzbo
Registered: 09-2005
| | Posted on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 6:16 pm: | |
ok, thanks for the info, my luthier said the bridge has to be custom fitted , set up etc hence the price, of course im in los angeles, everything is a tad more here, now, CAN ANYONE TELL ME ABOUT THE DIFFERENCE IN SOUND THAT I MAY ENCOUNTER, PROBLEMS, ETC ETC, |
Trickeydave
Username: Trickeydave
Registered: 08-2005
| | Posted on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 6:33 pm: | |
Without a doubt you will get a much warmer, darker (jazzier?) tone with the wood bridge, IMO. I've seen 2355s with the wooden bridges...is the metal type standard stock? One thing I encountered on my ebony bridge quest was whether to purchase one with the two "legs" on the base or the type that has a solid continuous base. Turns out the tone's about the same for both; but the bridge with the legs can set up higher if you need that. It depends on how high your strings are off the body. With my AK85 I needed a higher setup. |
Fg100
Username: Fg100
Registered: 03-2004
| | Posted on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 7:30 pm: | |
I have ebony on my 2355. It sounds very nice. I don't know how much difference it will make since I have never played with metal bridge.
I have 0.12 flatwound on it. It came with 0.10 roundwound... I think 0.10 or maybe 0.11 is better for such a narrow neck. |
Jazzzbo
Username: Jazzzbo
Registered: 09-2005
| | Posted on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 8:08 pm: | |
Im not sure if my bridge is stock or not,, the base has the legs at the ends, and the bridge appears to be an I banez tuneomatic type, so im guessing if you have to set up the guitar later with the wood bridges its more of a time consuming thing, ps my neck width at the nut measures 1 15/16 and i find its not skinny, feels good for chords etc, ps this guitar has no serial number, no sticker, yet has the guild type rather than open book headstock, and is the ice tea style sunburst, sounds killer!! |
Jazzzbo
Username: Jazzzbo
Registered: 09-2005
| | Posted on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 8:20 pm: | |
1 11/16 on the neck. is this supposed to be the skinny neck?? |
Fg100
Username: Fg100
Registered: 03-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, August 19, 2006 - 6:05 am: | |
Mine is 4 cm at the nut. To be or not to be narrow is a personal preference, right? For my way of playing it makes it uncomfortable. On the other hand, I really like the shape of the neck. For me it would be, that shape but wider width.
Mine has the open book and the color I guess is like yours. Could you post some pictures? |
Gemberbier
Username: Gemberbier
Registered: 05-2006
| | Posted on Thursday, August 31, 2006 - 1:40 pm: | |
Hi Jazzzbo!
As I remember this is about a 2355 from 1973, isn't it?
Well, in that particular year the 2355 were made with both types of bridges, the tune-o-matic imitation was pictured in the American catalogue, while the wooden bridge was pictured in the other 1973 catalogues.
http://members.lycos.nl/ibanez2355site/catalogues.htm
It's possible that these catalogues are from different months of 1973, but that's something I couldn't figure out. But because your guitar has no serial number, nobody will ever know in which month it was produced. Your dad bought it new in 1973 as I remember your story, so that's first hand information: IT IS A 1973 IBANEZ 2355 PERIOD.
So buy a nice new hight adjustable and compensated saddle wooden bridge (€14.= P-102-P palisander = rosewood or €15.= P-102-E ebben = ebony).
http://www.backandforth.nl/bridges.html
This is just an example of what they should cost.
So that's 18-19 dollars.
And install it yourself, $55.= for installing a bridge is a ripp-off, because it's a piece of cake!
All you need to do when the bridge hasn't got the same arch as the top of your guitar is put some sand paper on the top of your guitar on the spot where you bridge should come with the sand up.
Now you start sanding the concave arched bottom of your new bridge until it has the exact shape of your guitar's arched top and ready you are.
Another possibility is to buy the new bridge of the same wood as your existing bridge and swap the saddle, but then you must know the exact dimenstions of the old and new bridge and their adjusting screws.
So you can either swap the saddle or the entire bridge.
Keep the old bridge or saddle in the case and no harm is done, since it's a 1973!
Pictures of the bridge would be nice. Humbird (Daniel) has an early 70s 2355 with a cheap looking metal bridge which was thought to be (non-Ibanez) after sales, because in the catalogue they look more solid. We could compare your bridge with Humbird's bridge. (Pure curiousity).
Greetz,
Ginger |
Gemberbier
Username: Gemberbier
Registered: 05-2006
| | Posted on Thursday, August 31, 2006 - 1:41 pm: | |
Another tip for a warmer more jazzy sound when you use standard roundwound strings: use a wound 3rd (G) string instead of a plain steel 3rd.
I know that Dean Markley but also d'Addario sell roundwound .011 sets with a wound 3rd especially for jazz guitars. So if you don't have it yet you could start buying a single d'Addario wound 3rd, and buy a round wound jazz set the next time you need new strings.
Oh yeah... another thing... about the width of the neck: it's metric, so never 27/16 inch (which would be 42,8625 mm).
Mine is 42 mm at the nut outside and 3.5 inside (E to E), so even narrower than your measurement and yes that's quite narrow for a jazz box.
One could reduce the outside space from 3.5 mm to 2.5 mm in order to gain 0.4 mm per string spacing. Don't replace the nut yourself! Changing the nut and the string spacing is a professional luthier job (not cheap).
But then it wouldn't be original anymore, so if you have it done, be shure you have the old nut taken off without damaging it and keep it in the case!
Ginger |
Jazzzbo
Username: Jazzzbo
Registered: 09-2005
| | Posted on Thursday, August 31, 2006 - 7:32 pm: | |
MY 2355 im thinking is in reality about late 1975? it has the guild type head stock, not the open book, but no serial number and no sticker, it also has the gibson type adjustable metal bridge which i think is original Ibanez of that era, im still toying with the idea of putting the wood bridge but not sure, i put d addario 11s round would on and im experimenting with the sound, the flat wounds sounded dull to me, but i may just be used to the rounds on my other guitars. also my guitar has the ice tea or antique type sunburst, jazzz |
Gemberbier
Username: Gemberbier
Registered: 05-2006
| | Posted on Thursday, August 31, 2006 - 10:05 pm: | |
I remember you writing about a 1973 guitar a while ago.
The Guild headstock and a missing serial number is an very odd combination, considering this info on the redesigned headstocks:
http://members.lycos.nl/ibanez2355site/lawsuit.htm
Your guitar seems to prove they already started redesigning headstocks before 1976.
BTW
Also in 1975 we find both types of bridges, the German catalogues show ebony bridges and the American catalogues show tune-o-matics. I guess it's a matter of national preference (Germany seems to tend to the old school wooden jazz guitar parts).
You can experiment as much as you want, as long as you keep the original parts with the guitar.
I think your guitar is very special because it's in between two periods and has features of both periods. Historically that's very interesting.
Greetz,
Ginger |
Jazzzbo
Username: Jazzzbo
Registered: 09-2005
| | Posted on Thursday, August 31, 2006 - 10:28 pm: | |
I will try and get some pics up one of these days. i like the idea of being able to adjust the strings individually, but i also like the idea of the woody tone with the wood bridge, my concern is that someone will have to install that bridge and cut the slots , set it up etc, the case seems to be original by looking at similar 2355 from the internet . there seems to be a space above the headstock area of about 3-4 inches, is this common to the original hard case? jazzz |
Gemberbier
Username: Gemberbier
Registered: 05-2006
| | Posted on Friday, September 01, 2006 - 12:05 pm: | |
Who says you need slots in an ADJUSTABLE wooden bridge? Your strings stay in place because of the spacing of your tailpiece! DON'T CUT SLOTS!
If it's too high, turn it lower with the adjusting screw wheels.
Setting it up??? Etc.??? $55.=???
It's all bull...
There is NOTHING about this job you can't do yourself!
All you need is some sandpaper and some masking tape to attach it to the top where the old bridge was with the sand up.
Chafe the bottom of you bridge over the sandpaper untill it has the exact radius and shape of the underlaying top. That's all.
The intonation was discussed several times here.
Just look it up using Search. These bridges are COMPENSATED. So leave the IDEA of individually adjustable saddles for your tune-o-matic. Just intonate it right once and when you replace strings, do it one by one without releasing the tension of the other strings.
A little self-confidence, Jazzz.
You will be working on a part that is the same price as a set of jazz strings. So, there's not much to screw up. Look at the enrichment because of the learning process. You'll start understanding your instrument better and become a more complete musician because of it. Believe me, THERE IS NO MAGIC in instrument making. It's a craft, and I think any guitarist can learn the basics of it. That includes you, unless you have a severe disability (hands, eyes, ears).
About your case...
I haven't seen it, but ES-175 model cases are just dreadnought cases with an arched lid. Now some of these cases were made for 12-strings as
well.
And because these have huge headstocks...
I've seen original cases for the 2355 with blue lining and yellow lining. (Mine is yellow and is from November 1976).
But if you want to be sure whether yours is original or not, you could upload a picture. Even that is difficult to say. Because even when it is from the right period, it might come from another (12-string) guitar. But that doesn't matter. 12-string cases are harder to get. When you need one, you won't find one. You experience that when you want to ship a 12-string Japanese BOZO (by Yairi). Oh my God, what a headstock!
So, you should be glad there is some extra space in the case. It's protective and multifunctional. And don't worry, your guitar can't move up. The shaped part keeps it in place.
Greetz,
Ginger |
Jazzzbo
Username: Jazzzbo
Registered: 09-2005
| | Posted on Friday, September 01, 2006 - 1:48 pm: | |
Ok thanks for the info about the bridge set up etc. it all makes perfect sense now. i will report later if i decide to get the compensated bridge, althought the metal is working fine so far, FYI. there is a guy here that has a similar guitar as mine. tulip headstock, no serial number but it does have a sticker inside, and its a blonde. i think it was posted a few months ago, thanks again for all the help. jazzz |
Petruz
Username: Petruz
Registered: 05-2004
| | Posted on Friday, November 17, 2006 - 5:03 am: | |
jazzzbo, i changed the metal bridge of my PM100 with a wooden one. i like the tone, more "woody" (obvious). but it depends on what type of music you make... maybe for blues it would be nice to keep the metal bridge.
keep in mind that all the superior or handmade archtops have wooden bridges, that means something.
i agree with ginger, seting up the guitar is part of a musicians' experience and it's very pleasing.
changing the tailpiece took me less than five minutes. tape the angles of the existing bridge to have a reference on the top of the guitar. loosen (but not take off) the strings. carefully take off the existing bridge and put in the new one. adjust the action and you're done! |
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