Vintage Model 1910 BLUEBURST - what y...

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Author Message Theguitarcustomshop Username: Theguitarcustomshop Registered: 09-2006 Posted on Monday, September 04, 2006 - 3:47 pm:    Its a Model 1910, private-labelled "Hohn". Back in 1980, I picked up one of these second-hand in a pawnshop in Canada. Unfortunately, i lost it later that year, and i've been looking for another one ever since! As luck would have it, though I'm on the OTHER SIDE OF THE PLANET now, recently somebody from Canada tracked me down via the web and offered me this one - IDENTICAL in every way!!! (what are the chances of THAT?) Now that i have it in hand, i'm certain that its NOT the same example as i used to have (this one is in much better condition!).. so there are at least TWO of these blue-bursts in existence :-) My question is, can anybody tell me what YEAR this was made? Its got the roller bridge, zero fret, and chrome "V/T" knobs... Its also got a SERIAL NUMBER, and the neckplate is definitely original to this guitar (as are all the other parts!) - i am wondering, does anyone know how to decode these numbers? (or do they even mean anything at all?) here are links to some larger pictures: http://shamraybass.com/pix/Ibanez01.JPG http://shamraybass.com/pix/Ibanez02.JPG http://shamraybass.com/pix/Ibanez03.JPG Thanks In Advance... Johns Username: Johns Registered: 02-2001 Posted on Monday, September 04, 2006 - 8:58 pm:    CustomShop: Cool looking guitar! I've never heard of the Hohn label. Something strikes me strange, though. Why is this guitar, circa 1970/1971 in such good shape? Maybe you have a great camera? Also the other detail that doesn't fit is the square corners on the fretboard. Is it possible that this is really a great "reissue"? Harry Username: Harry Registered: 03-2001 Posted on Tuesday, September 05, 2006 - 3:21 am:    Come to think of it.... Over here in Europe we know the German factory of musical instruments called "Hohner". Maybe it's not so strange to believe that way back in the early seventies this company ordered a badge of guitars in Japan and came up with the brand name "Hohn"? Just a thought.... Kind greetz, Harry Johns Username: Johns Registered: 02-2001 Posted on Tuesday, September 05, 2006 - 8:18 am:    Harry: What do you think of the serial number and the square corners on the fretboard? Harry Username: Harry Registered: 03-2001 Posted on Tuesday, September 05, 2006 - 3:11 pm:    Hmmmmm John. Strange to me too. According the square fretboard end you might think (if it were Hoshino built) that it must have been made around 1973. But then again the knobs don't match, since these are clearly late 60's. Serial number: no clue, really. Ibanez (Hoshino) started using them in 1975. Long time before that Aria guitars had about the same type of neckplates and serial numbers. I'd guess this Hohn guitar was from the same factory as where Aria came from. But then again: it's just a guess.... Harry Theguitarcustomshop Username: Theguitarcustomshop Registered: 09-2006 Posted on Tuesday, September 05, 2006 - 6:27 pm:    Actually those are pretty poor quality pics, the guitar is in almost 'shiny immaculate' shape - aside from the wear on the corners of the headstock, and a couple of tiny scratches here and there. NO FRETWEAR! I was a little disappointed when i got it and saw how good the condition was.. i was actually HOPING that this was my long lost 1980 guitar! (which was a little more beat up) I'm almost certain "Hohn" (or perhaps its "ABC Hohn"?) is UNRELATED to Hohner, and rather just a private 'store label' brand done only for the Canadian market, much like the Mann and Raven guitars that were so common there when i was starting out in the 70s. ("Ibanez", "Univox", and "National" were affordable guitars of choice too, before we started seeing floods of the real cheapos like "Hondo" and "Westbury" and "Cort"...) If its a "re-issue" then they must have started re-issuing them in the mid seventies, since the one i found in 1980 had been gathering dust in a pawnshop for YEARS (i didnt even know that the first one was BLUE until i took it home and cleaned it off) This one is identical to my first example in EVERY WAY, (right down to the little pointers under the knobs!) and must have been from the same run. I'm just wondering if anyone knows about the production levels back then, and if the serial number could have some significant meaning like "217th day of 1970 - 20th guitar made" (a system like that would work if they made less than 99 guitars a day back then!) or maybe 217th guitar of the 20th week of 1970 ?? (which could work too, if they made less than 999 guitars a WEEK!) or maybe its just some random numbers that dont mean anything? :-) I DO recall the other example had the same kind of neck plate and i even remember writing down the serial number for my gear list (unfortunately the ensuing 26 years have not been kind to my band gear records!) Snowjays Username: Snowjays Registered: 09-2004 Posted on Wednesday, September 06, 2006 - 7:26 am:    It looks to me to be a Matsumoku made guitar, same as Aria, Electra, Westone, Vantage etc. The serial no indicates the year(first digit) and then the number of guitars in that run. Hence 197(2) manufacture. A number of these models were made for Greco. Check this site out:- http://www.matsumoku.org/models/models.html Gemberbier Username: Gemberbier Registered: 05-2006 Posted on Wednesday, September 06, 2006 - 12:04 pm:    Found another one: http://www.myrareguitars.com/1970guitars.html We saw this guitar as Ibanez 1910 some time ago with the same humbuckers: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=230014921371 Whether Hohn is connected to Hohner, I haven't found out yet. Ginger Theguitarcustomshop Username: Theguitarcustomshop Registered: 09-2006 Posted on Thursday, September 07, 2006 - 9:15 am:    Snowjays: the link you pointed to (info pasted below) indicates its probably an ARBITRARY (meaningless) number... and (if we can believe it!) rules out Matsumoko entirely, since also states that Matsumoko didnt start making serialed guitars til 76 or 77 (which wouldnt jive with the "first digit=year" theory) This is CLEARLY not a 1982 guitar (I bought my first example 'well-used" in 1980...) :-) The plot thickens... ============================================== Shiro Arai Co. Most guitars produced by Arai such as the Aria Diamonds (not to be confused with the Aria Pro II Diamonds), Lyle, Conrad, Maxi-Tone, Japanese Epiphone, Univox, and the other pre-1976 guitars often had serial numbers usually on the neck plate (I imagine so dealers could track warranty, etc.). Unfortunately the number was arbitrary and had little to do with when the guitar was produced. After Arai joined forces with Matsumoku, the serial numbers began to have some bearing on the guitar's production year and rank in production sequence. Serial numbers on these guitars were arbitrary numbers and did not indicate date of manufacture. When dating these guitars only ballpark ranges is possible. One tip is the type of pickups. Single coil trapezoid face = mid to late 1960s, P-90 sized single and dual coil pickups = early 1970s, normal humbuckers and more strat like singles = early to mid 1970s. . Guitars produced by Matsumoku Nearly all guitars produced by Matsumoku (beginning sometime late 1976 or early 1977) bore serial numbers indicating the year and possibly production sequence. A small number of guitars produced had serials preceeded by a letter, but as to what the letter inidicated is yet a mystery and one can only guess without concrete evidence. I have seen both 6 and 7 digit serial numbers (excluding the letter if it is present).This new serialization covered Aria, Aria Pro II, Vantage, Westbury, most Westones, Japanese Washburns, some Electras, and the Skylark as well as others. As far as I know, the Korean version of these labels bear 8 or more digit serials and sometimes the production locaciton code (letter indicating Korea, Phillipines, Indonesia, etc.) which does not concern us here. . The first digit (and upon rare occasion the first two) indicated the year. There is an inherent flaw with this single-digit method as the single digit year indicator will re-cycle after a decade! Attention must be paid to when the particular model was available and apply that to the first digit of the serial, excluding the letter if present. A bit of cross referencing is required. For example, my first Cardinal CS-350 has the serial 2010237 which indicates both by the first digit and the duration of the Cardinal CS-350 run it is a 1982 (and I know it is, I bought it then!). In rare instances the first two digits would indicate the year, in which case we can safely assume that my Cardinal is not a 1920! Had it been the two-digit version it would have begun with 82XXXXX rather than 20XXXXX, which would also indicate 1982. Johns Username: Johns Registered: 02-2001 Posted on Thursday, September 07, 2006 - 10:04 am:    Well I guess it's official, there were Hohn labeled model 1910s from the very early 70s and they did have square fretboard corners. Here's the one from the myrareguitars link in Gemberbier's message above: This demonstrates that there was a convoluted connection among many of the Japanese factories in the early 70's. Interesting to know that history, but it also shows that "Ibanez" was a brand name and NOT a factory. Snowjays Username: Snowjays Registered: 09-2004 Posted on Friday, September 08, 2006 - 6:50 am:    "Arbitary" means that there is no known sequence for how these were numbered. Matsumoku produced a similar guitar labelled it as a Greco in the late '60 and very early '70. Here's one version. Matsumoku used serial no's on guitars from the late '60's. Is your's single coil or humbucker?

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