| Author |
Message |
JohnS
| | Posted on Monday, April 02, 2001 - 12:38 pm: | |
For nearly 2 decades I've played guitar by myself. It been tons of fun. Beyond that I've jammed with one other guitar player or once in a blue moon a bass player and once a drummer. Those were fantastic experiences.
After trying to learn songs from books I realized that having the track was immensely helpful in learning the "song". But playing by yourself is never a problem. When you miss something, you can get back to it or simply leave it out.
But graduating to playing in a group setting has really shown me how little I know. First off, I'm asked to play music that I would not have chosen to learn on my own. In the past, I've resisted learning songs because they contained chords I didn't feel comfortable fingering. But in a group you have a job to do and you can't play only the simple songs or the ones you like.
There's now tons more stuff to learn and remember. If you learned the song from sheet music, the singer in your band might sing it in a different key. So you have to change. Also, the arrangements are likely to be different than the way you learned the song.
So, what tips, tricks, techniques, memory aids, attitudes and mindsets do you use to cope with stepping up to the next level of playing guitar in a group?
Also, if you've just become a "cog in a music machine", how do you get back the joy you first felt while jamming with your bandmates? |
GRAHAM LEES (Graham)
| | Posted on Monday, April 02, 2001 - 4:04 pm: | |
Hi,
Just to throw my opinion in - I have worked in bands almost since day one of playing the guitar...(for better or worse !).
Love playing guitar in a band setting as it forces me to improve my technique - often find that rehearsing in group situation gives me that extra motivation to get to grips with 'diffulcult chord shapes' and the like..
Tips tricks and memory aids :-
I often write a crib sheet / chord sheet out for rehearsals - particularly if you have got to learn lots of songs in similar keys in a short space of time.
I also try to learn the tracks well enough to be able to improvise within the structures - this to me is were playing gets really enjoyable.
Also, as goes without saying, adopt a proffesional attitude to the material - a lazy approach is a lazy sound !
Never be afraid to ask your bandmates to 'run that section again'. Particularly if you are working out a solo....
Not sure I'm a cog in the music machine (despite my best attempts!) but I teach music all day then come home and write more music. Don't find this to disrupt my joy at all !
However, having said that going to rehearse with my current band on a weekend is one of the few things that could persuade me out of bed at 8am on a Saturday morning..
I find having an easy 'reward' song to jam about with at the end of a succesfull rehearsal is a useful ploy in stopping 'artistic strain' after a long session of song honing.
Currently we improvise around Van Morrisons Gloria if we feel we have accompalished all we set out to acheive in a rehearsal....
Hope my opinion is of interest to someone.
cheers
Graham
p.s. check out www.scuzzy.org if you want to hear how bad I can make an Ibanez sound !! |
Harold Wherry (Blues)
| | Posted on Monday, April 02, 2001 - 8:46 pm: | |
John,
It is always best practice to know how to play a song in more than one key. When in a band you can almost always expect to be asked to play a song in another key. The more you do it the easier it gets.
You might want to buy a good Chord Dictionary or Chord Encyclopedia. I believe "Mel Bay Publications" has a good Chord Encyclopedia. A Chord Encyclopedia can show you several ways to position the same chord on the fingerboard. As you get into it you will discover that in many cases a single chord can have several different names. You also need to learn how to construct chords. All of the above will help ease the burden of having to learn a song in a different key and help you get away from playing the same familiar chords.
Harold |
Mark Munchenberg (Munch)
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 03, 2001 - 1:34 am: | |
John,
I've got a different approach from Graham and Harold which I'm sure is born of an ignorance of musical theory.
You see, I can't read music, I have to think long and hard to name the notes in any major scale outside of C, and transposing on the spot is not easy unless it is a blues of course.
I learn the song from playing the records at home. I don't learn at band rehearsal - this wastes everyones time. I learn the parts as best I can and then get together with the guys where we all practice making our parts come together with each other to form a good band sound.
I certainly don't get hung up on reproducing every note and phrase off the record perfectly. I respect people who can do that, but for me I feel I will never develop my own style if all I do is copy other peoples licks.
In a live situation I will usually play all riffs and rhythm parts as per the record. However when it comes to soloing I improvise 90% of them, and I never play the same solo the same way twice. It is only songs that have highly structured signature solos (such as Stray Cat Strut) where I will learn the solo lick for lick and play it the same all the time.
I agree with Harold that a good knowledge of chords and their construction is a great skill to have. The possibilities for your playing will really open up. I myself have not invested the time into learning this stuff so I know my limitations. As such I play only what I am comfortable with live and play to my strengths. In some ways I think my approach is similar to Steve Miller's although we certainly don't sound similar.
The most important thing you can develop John when playing with other people is a good sense of meter. You want to have a steady and consistent beat in your playing. This will help you to lock in with the other band members.
I actually find that I am the time keeper in most situations. It is a myth that drummers keep a constant beat. Many I have played with speed up and slow down depending on the excitement level of the song.
Hope this helps,
Mark |
Harold Wherry (Blues)
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 03, 2001 - 2:53 pm: | |
John,
Once upon a time a Studio Musician was asked:
"Do you know how to READ MUSIC? ....
The Studio Musician replied:
YES - But just enough as to NOT get in the way of my PLAYING!
When working with other musicians you will need a fast and efficient means of communicating a songs musical composition.
In the place of "reading music" I have found that:
_if you are able to communicate a songs CHORD STRUCTURE and
_if you are able to play the CHORDS as they are communicated (EXAMPLE: E-7b5 / A7+5b9 / D-9 )
The above chords are (E minor 7th flat 5) / (A dominant 7th augmented 5) / D minor 9th).
A good Chord Encyclopedia will show you how to construct these chords.
Regards,
Harold |
GRAHAM LEES (Graham)
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 03, 2001 - 3:33 pm: | |
Hi,
Just to add to the chord analysis strand. I find it easier to break chords down if I think of them in terms of piano keyboards (even though I'm even less of a keyboard player than a guitarist !) - from there you can work out voicings relevant to the guitar, this allows me get out of the habit of just moving shapes up and down the neck.
I recommend the ABRSM grade 1-5 book as a good starting point for anyone who wants to look into how chords 'work' - it starts from the assumption that the reader has no knowledge of 'the dots' it is very useful in that respect.
Totally agree with Mark about the time keeping thing - having played bass to click tracks in the past in the studio and heard the very unnnatural results ! Tempo movement is an intergral part of the excitement of a live playing, but I think the ability to lock onto 'the one' is what makes a tight band.
Cheers
Graham |
Paddy_F (Paddy_F)
| | Posted on Friday, October 10, 2003 - 10:00 am: | |
heres a useful site, especially this lick, anybody know other useful sites.
http://www.chopsfactory.com/hj10_08.html
keep on rocking, Paddy. |
Mr_Roadstar (Mr_Roadstar)
| | Posted on Friday, October 10, 2003 - 12:39 pm: | |
I don't sweat learning a song exactly the way it was recorded, because:
1) I don't play in a cover band
2) When we do cover a tune, we do our own arrangement (often much removed from the original)
2) I prefer writing and playing original material (if ya screw up, nobody knows!)
4) My technical guitar skills suck
I can read treble cleff, but can't translate it to guitar. I played trumpet for many years so guitar is like a second language.
The best advice I can give anyone for playing in a group: HAVE FUN !! Yes, sometimes it's hard work, but even that aspect should be enjoyable. Stress and frustration need to be kept at a minimum level.
Cheers
Steve |
Funkle (Funkle)
| | Posted on Thursday, October 16, 2003 - 9:24 pm: | |
Off topic, but here are some site and books I have found useful recently:
http://www.wholenote.com/
oodles of lessons.
Funk Guitar - The Essential Guide - Ross Bolton.
Great for building rhythmic accuracy, even if you don't like funk.
Contemporary Chord Khancepts - Steve Khan
A very effective (and unusual) approach to building and understanding chord use.
Effortless Masetrey - Kenny Werner.
Among other things, he taught me that it's way more beneficial to learn one thing really well, than a bunch of things half-ass.
-Sven |
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