Setting Up Your Guitar - What's Your ...

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Author Message Johns (Johns) Posted on Sunday, March 31, 2002 - 11:16 am:    I'm starting this thread to address some questions asked in the Semi-hollow section about guitar setups. (Disclaimer: this message is long and rambling and the info is geared towards those inexperienced with working on their guitars. The following are my "unschooled" opinions. I hope that more experienced players/techs will add their thoughts and experiences.) I'm sure that many guitar techs or luthiers will say that every guitar "needs" to be setup, even if it's brandy new from the factory. After all, the factory's goal is to move guitars out the door and they set them up to specs that fit somebody's idea of the "common" guitar player. But players are individuals, so the factory specs are only starting points of reference, based on prevailing conventional wisdom (subject to change without notice. ) In the real-world, any guitar that has been shipped over a long distance, by a common carrier who takes no special care of handling or environmental conditions, (how do you think your guitar got from Japan or Korea to the local music store?) would probably arrive "out of spec". That's because it's primarily made of wood, not metal or concrete! It's probably playable, though. (Maybe Cameron can tell us where, in the chain from factory to store, setups are likely to be done?) An important part of the factory spec is string guage. As soon as you change the guage you have moved the guitar "out of spec". Technically, the nut, bridge, neck and pickups "could" be adjusted to optimize the guitar. Should you worry about these? I've read too many articles over the years that quote guitar heros who's personal preferences contradict "conventional wisdom" of guitar setup. In the end, it comes down to what each player feels and hears. For new guitars, there are some changes that "could" affect the guitar and should trigger some thought about setup: extreme string guage changes (going from 8s to 13s, or vice versa); tremolo adjustments or moving an adjustable bridge or saddles; pickup or polepiece height changes and truss rod adjustments. I'm not saying don't experiment with the foregoing. But if you do, and the guitar doesn't sound or feel right anymore, it's time to look for some help. Beyond the issues that can affect new guitars, used guitars have additional concerns. The chances are good that it may have been subject to years of experimentation by the previous owner(s) or not maintained. So, it will probably have issues that a luthier/tech can improve. OK, now that the technical rant is over, here's my experience with setup issues. I've only bought 1 new guitar in my 30 years of guitar experience. (How could I play so horribly after such a long time? That's another thread.) That was a fairly cheap Pennco acoustic. Eventually, I used it as a learning tool and worked on it myself. The only guitar I ever had setup by a professional was a '64 Gibson Melody Maker that had tons of previous customization work. On the recommendation of a friend, I took it to a man named Lou Mercury in Burlington, NJ. It seemed obvious that he knew what he was doing (he had some relationship with Aerosmith and that was good enough for me ). But when I came to pick it up he seemed pretty nonchalant about the work he had done. Had he improved it's playablity? I can't remember that it made a remarkable difference. I thought "Oh well, this expert says the guitar is working the best it can" and left it at that. Presently I own 15+ electric, semi-hollow or acoustic guitars. All were purchased used and range in age from 1972 to 1988. None of these guitars have been to the "doctor". But I know that some have issues that will need professional attention. I play them all; none of the problems are show stoppers. I'm not bragging nor proud, just confessing to be lazy and cheap. However, if I made a living with my guitars, I would certainly mend my evil ways! My personal thoughts about guitars setups: If the guitar is new and it doesn't feel or play properly i.e., buzzes, fretting out anywhere on the neck, the action is very different from one end of the neck to the other, drastic volume differences between strings, harmonics don't ring at the 5th, 7th and 12 frets, open notes are out of tune with those fretted at 12th, or the guitar won't stay in tune, TAKE IT BACK! Point out the problem and ask to have it fixed. If you don't experience any problems, save your money and experiment with different strings and guages. When you find what you like, think about whether you "need" the guitar setup again. How does it sound and feel, now? If in doubt, ask a more experienced player to check out your axe. I think a very important issue is that every guitar player should learn to maintain his guitar. This includes basic setup adjustments that can be learned and made at home. You'll have to make the following investments: a good tuner, a few special wrenches and screw drivers, some polish and cleaning fluids, some good books and your time and effort. Please note: IMO, except for fretwork, truss rod adjustments and certain tremolo adjustments, almost every problem you can get into while learning to do your own setups can be easily undone. But even if you are leery of doing your own work, or don't have the time and tools, or have the cash to let someone else do the work for you, you'll derive great benefits from learning how your guitar works. First, you'll be able to speak intelligently and confidently with the person(s) doing your work. It will help you evaluate whether a person is qualified to do the work. And will also help you to become a better guitar buyer. Anyway, maybe I'm just full of hooey. What are your thoughts? Also, I invite all to share their favorite resources for gaining the knowledge to maintain their guitars. Johns (Johns) Posted on Sunday, March 31, 2002 - 11:22 am:    Oops, I've only been noodling/playing for 27 years. Russellw (Russellw) Posted on Sunday, March 31, 2002 - 8:41 pm:    Some good points John. I've had a couple of my dozen guitars set-up by Pros as they were way out harmonically and I'm glad I did but for most of the other little things I've just done them myself. Gives you an added appreciation of how the instrument works technically which can turn out to be very useful. I think the key here is to know where your limits are - I usually don't touch electronics apart from using a multimeter to check out circuits 'cos my soldering looks more like welding and it's not worth the hassle. Cheers Russ Cameron (Cameron) Posted on Monday, April 01, 2002 - 6:27 am:    John, in regards to setups on Ibanez guitars we do ours as they are ordered by our dealers,it doesn't matter if its a RX20 or a GB200BS each guitar we send out is fully checked and setup to the factory specs before it leaves our warehouse.Usually after shipping, the guitar may need a quick tune up, but thats it.I will send you a copy of the factory setup specs to your email and then you can post it for all to read. Keep on rockin' Cameron Guitaki (Guitaki) Posted on Tuesday, April 02, 2002 - 7:14 pm:    John, great thread! I have set up guitars in a (pretty small) music store for several years now. I was very interested already in my first real guitar (an early 80's Squier Strat), and I used to tweak it in and out all the time. That was in the age of 14 or so. I put new (and more) pickups, painted the body for several times, added more switches, and all in all, did very many terrible things to the guitar. A few times I had to take the guitar (and later my amp also ;o) to a repairsman, since I had tried a fer things too much with it! But I was learning. Nowadays I have noticed that I have a setup of my own that I prefer. I have my guitars' action very low. In every guitar I have played (other than mine), this would mean a lot of work, the saddle, the bridge, and the tuss-rod to be tweaked. Also, everyone that has ever tried my instruments are very surprised how good it feels. I talk them to bring their guitars to be set up by me, and afterwards they are very surprised, because they didn't know their guitars can feel this easy to play! One of my friends was happy to start using 10 gauge strings instead of 9 after I promised him that his guitar would be easier to play when decently set up for a 10 gauge set, compared to what it was now with 9'ers. And the sound was a lot, lot better! Another friend of mine has a very expensive Martin acoustic. It was terrible and very hard to play, had never been set up. Again, I asked if I could even just tighten the tuss-rod a bit. "Tuss-what?" he asked.. After a modest and quick first-aid tweak, he was very pleased that his guitar was so much easier to play. If he would try out my acoustic, I bet he would be shocked! This has grown a new slight problem. Whenever I play a guitar that is not mine, it feels very hard and bad. I can't play well with a guitar that is not set up for me. Sometimes people don't understad this, because they are offering a very expensive PRS; "How can it not be good enough for me?!"... John made a great suggestion: Let other players take a look on Your axe, and ask if it should be set up. Also, it would be good if You could test differently set up guitars to check what Your preference would be. You just might find a totally new approach to guitar playing as many of my friends have. Shame is, nobody knows how their guitars can play if they would be set up well. If it is an expensive guitar, they think "this is it", and don't demand any more. Everybody doesn't like their strings very low, but most of them have never tried a guitar that is well set up. If the strings are set low, it is always easy to rise them back up. But I bet You can't lower the strings too much without a great deal of buzz, if the strings hasn't been set up for low action. Phew.. this topic always gets me going.. -Aki. Fredb (Fredb) Posted on Saturday, April 27, 2002 - 12:10 pm:    Great topic, I'd say it's definitely worthwhile to be able to do a lot of the tweaking needed to get a guitar playing at its best. My own theory has been that as long as a guitar is structurally and technically sound (neck angle pitch correct, scale length correct, frets seated properly, nut and bridge correct), nearly any guitar can be made to be play decent. Especially since now you can pick up well made guitars in the $300-$400 dollar range, or even cheaper if you managed to catch the DeArmond blowout a while back ;-) IMHO the most important thing in doing work yourself is having the right tools. For me, the latest setup "breakthrough" was finally figuring out the real connection between action and neck relief, and tailoring it to each guitar. Before touching the truss rod, it's important to have both a set of straightedges (from stewmac or other parts supplier) and a gap tool (the sets they make for auto spark plugs work fine). I know this from experience since I ended up with backbow on one of my guitars by tightening just a little too much. The funny thing about setups is they might need a second look ~1-2 weeks later, a good sign when getting a pro setup is when a "follow-up" is immediately offered, as the wood might settle and require a second adjustment if extreme changes are made. Fred Smooth (Smooth) Posted on Thursday, May 30, 2002 - 9:04 am:    I see it like this, I'm a guitarplayer and not not a technician so for most problems I go to a luthier. At this moment I have to replace my broken my bridge :-( The piece was so damaged (the guitar landed on the bridge, don't mention..)that I had to order a new one and since you have to file these parts I have to call my guitartech. Still most setup can be done by oneself as there are very usefull guitar set ups tips at Larry Vignault's site ; http://www.ma.ultranet.com/~larryv/guitarsetup.htm Mike Johns (Johns) Posted on Thursday, May 30, 2002 - 9:51 am:    Mike: Sorry to hear about the damage to your axe! That was you asking on the jazz newsgroup about glueing the broken bridge together, no? Couldn't hurt to try...that's what they do with headstocks that snap off. The worse that could happen is that it doesn't hold up. Great link for guitar setups. I thought this was pretty cool: Conditioning The Fretboard Hot - Here's a product that I've been using for some time now, and it's absolutely the best fingerboard treatment I've found on the market. I have absolutely no affiliation with the company, I just love the product, and since it's very difficult to find, I've decided to spread the word. The product is Gerlitz GUITAR HONEY. I haven't found any other product that will remove grime and condition the fingerboard as nicely as GUITAR HONEY. Here's the description from the back of the bottle: "In my search for the ultimate instrument fingerboard treatment I've discovered a unique blend of exotic oils which, when applied to your instrument's (rosewood, ebony, etc) fingerboard, will enhance the wood's natural character giving it a smooth silky feel, and a lustrous glowing sheen, while protecting against water, sweat, alchohol, and grime in general ... (a benefit towards longer lasting string life as well). GUITAR HONEY is also highly effective in removing resin from violins and other string instruments . Sticky residue & grime from decals, stickers, etc is easily removed with GUITAR HONEY without harm to the instruments finish. REPAIR SHOP PROVEN. The results obtainable with GUITAR HONEY are superior to any other fingerboard oil or treatment available. After several years of research and exclusive use in my repair and custom shop, I've made GUITAR HONEY available to you. I can't think of a sweeter way to treat your fingerboard. ENJOY!" It comes in a small plastic bottle with a spray applicator containing 2 fluid ounces. Expect to pay about $6.00 or so for a bottle, however a bottle will last a long time. I only know of one shop in my area that sells it, and it's even difficult to find on the web. Here's where I buy mine, you can call them and ask them to ship it to you. The Music Emporium 165 Massachusetts Avenue Lexington, MA (781) 860-0049 Note: Guitar Honey is distributed by Kaman, Harris Teller, MBT and Chesbro. Any stores that deal with these distributors should be able to order Guitar Honey. Paddy_F (Paddy_F) Posted on Tuesday, December 16, 2003 - 8:56 am:    A question for the set up Gurus. I went to see Albert Lee last night (blistering country licks) and of course the club was heaving with guitarists, and I got into a discussion with one of them about neck set up. The local set up dude says he adjusts the truss rod so the neck has a slight concave bow in it to aleviate any fret buzz. Well when I bought my AM50 I found it a bit uncomfortable to play, so I lowered the action which helped a bit, then I checked the neck and found a slight bow, after straightening it, it was a different guitar. I can see the reasoning behind the bow in the neck, -- Most of the local guitarist are purists,-- anything less than 13 top E, on a pre 70's 335 or strat with an egg slicer action and youre a wus. I personally find this type of set up restricts fluencey, and would have me reaching for the elastoplast. (Im a Wus). So, do you have slight concave bow or not? merry xmas everyone, Paddy. Johns (Johns) Posted on Tuesday, December 16, 2003 - 10:53 am:    Paddy: This is the way the reason for a concave neck setup has been described to me: Take a wire, (actually you can do it with a rubber band, too) stretch it tight across two end points and then pluck it. When the wire vibrates, the center of will physically move much farther than the ends. You gotta give the string some extra room to vibrate or it'll hit the frets somewhere down the fretboard. So, they specifically "bow" the neck to compensate for the phenomena. Of course, the amount of bow changes when any other factor changes, like string thickness or tension, as well as nut and saddle height. So, everybody's mileage will vary, to some degree. Guitars with heavy strings and high action would not necessarily need a bow. Paddy_F (Paddy_F) Posted on Tuesday, December 16, 2003 - 3:11 pm:    Tnx John, looks like I need to put a small amount of relief back. Just found this on the net for anybody wanting to do their own set up. http://www.guitarnotes.com/notes/noteget.cgi?basic_guitar_setup Paddy. Sinder2000 (Sinder2000) Posted on Thursday, September 09, 2004 - 6:39 pm:    Need to do some work on my setup on my 684 -12. I would like to take some of the bow out of the neck. Need to know which way to turn the truss rod so I don't mess things up!! Ibanezfreak1960 (Ibanezfreak1960) Posted on Friday, September 10, 2004 - 2:28 pm:    Clockwise. Craigjc (Craigjc) Posted on Saturday, September 11, 2004 - 7:54 am:    Yes, Clockwise when you're looking straight at the end of the truss rod. If the triss rod adjustment is at the headstock, the headstock should be pointing directly at you. If you cannot turn the truss rod with readonable force, try loosening the strings. Turn it about 1/8 turn at a time and play it a while (sometimes the adjustments need to 'settle in'). Ibanezfreak1960 (Ibanezfreak1960) Posted on Saturday, September 11, 2004 - 5:20 pm:    Good point, clockwise when your looking straight on at it! I also agree with the little bit at a time and retune and play to see if its right for you. Bluepill (Bluepill) Posted on Monday, September 13, 2004 - 12:32 am:    regarding factory set-ups, while i was looking to buy an 2004 ar300 i played around 10 in total new ar250's, ar200bi, ar3000vv and a couple ar300hs artist. now if you think they are being set-up to a standard in the factory, think again!!! they were all different (some you could drive a bus under the strings. i think they dont really care too much with set-ups. i think a half decent luthier on a drug bender could do a better job with his eyes closed!! even the ar300 i bought had a twisted neck and buzzed like a 1950's fridge, i only bought it under the condition that the shop could set it up properly (which they did after 2 attempts), or the guitar be sent back to ibanez and replaced, which they were quite happy to do! i guess the point is with any new guitar, make sure the shop you buy it from look after you! and that goes for any brand. music stores are competing for your dollar, and if they wont look after you find someone who will. Sinder2000 (Sinder2000) Posted on Tuesday, September 14, 2004 - 5:40 pm:    thanks for getting back to me .I guess I can work out on it a bit now

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