| Author |
Message |
Spiro (Spiro)
| | Posted on Sunday, May 02, 2004 - 11:13 pm: | |
Hey Jim..
I was wondering what type and brand of finish is used on the current Ibanez guitars? |
Jim_Donahue (Jim_Donahue)
| | Posted on Monday, May 03, 2004 - 10:43 pm: | |
Well it depends on the model and country of manufacture., Every factory uses a little different formula. How ever Japan has been using the same paint for the last 30 years. Gen-Gen brand Polyester, This is sprayed on in a static paint booth. Well actually that is the clear, The paint is urathane base.
The only models that they make using a polyurethane clear are all the Jazz or Hollow bodies and the White Jem7, The reason is Polyester Yellows because of a chemical in it, (Colbolt) There are actually about 5 GB5 guitars out there that were sprayed with real Lacquer, It was funny the guy could only do one guitar a month so that did not last too long before they changed to urethane.
All Korean, Chinese and Indonesian made Ibanez models use a clear that is 50% Ployester and 50% urethane, The reason is faster drying.
Polyester was I believe brought over from The Surf Board Industry because it is so durable. Taylor, Brian moore, Tom Anderson, Ernie Ball and even Fender use it on almost all their products. |
Ericibanez (Ericibanez)
| | Posted on Thursday, May 06, 2004 - 10:49 pm: | |
Jim,
How would you suggest someone go about restoring a damaged finish on a 70's 80's Ibanez. I've got couple of beaters that I love and would like to refinish them.
Would it be easier to just do a complete refinishing from strip down since they are poly finished.
I know laquer can be repaired but I don't know anything about refins / repairing poly finishes.
Could you give advice, for example how to fix a ding in the finish or complete rifin if you have time.
Thanks,
Eric |
Jim_Donahue (Jim_Donahue)
| | Posted on Saturday, May 08, 2004 - 2:54 pm: | |
The truth is usually any repair unless done by some one really good will look worse than the dentt and scratches. Not old strats look better beat up and get good money that way, If you refinsh on, The value is gone.
So I never suggest refinish on a guitar unless it is done by the factory.
repairing poly is not hard but you will always see some Poly lines. Super Glue over a color that is the same works. Or you can repair Poly with Lacquer over it, Lacquer works on anything.
If it bothers you that much I say go to pep boys and find the color in the match a Color Sctach repair secyion, his has teh clear in it so its easy to use, Just try to find a fresh bottle, That is why i suugest a larger auto store. One other good reapir is nail Polish, If you can find the ame color, that way if you want to remove it a littl Acetone and its gone. Polyester is indistructable. the only way to get it off is with Heat.
JIm Donahue |
Ericsson (Ericsson)
| | Posted on Saturday, May 08, 2004 - 4:57 pm: | |
Don't refinish your guitars. You're better off selling them and buying mint examples if you are bothered by the scratches. It would be hard to get the color and overall look right and it will certainly hurt the vintage value if you care about that sort of thing. |
Spiro (Spiro)
| | Posted on Sunday, May 30, 2004 - 2:47 am: | |
hey ericsson,,
Are you serious in your above quote???? |
Ericsson (Ericsson)
| | Posted on Sunday, May 30, 2004 - 3:40 am: | |
Read this website for some good info.
Here's a qoute:
For example, a "beat-up" original finish guitar will always be worth much more than a perfectly refinished one. Even if the new finish is done professionally and looks perfect, it will be worth approximately half the price of an original finish guitar. |
Ericibanez (Ericibanez)
| | Posted on Saturday, June 05, 2004 - 10:41 am: | |
I sometimes get really beat up guitars that are not collectors items and I dont see anything wrong with refinishing them.
I certainly would like to be able to patch chip and dings - I have guitars with dings and if I can fix it like a professional I think thats great.
However, I would not refin a collectors piece because of the viewpoint stated by Ericsson above.
But the difference between a collectors piece and a non-collectors piece is in the eye of the beholder in some cases. Although there are obvious collectors items we all agree upon. |
Johns (Johns)
| | Posted on Saturday, June 05, 2004 - 5:27 pm: | |
Q: What's the difference between a collectible and a player?
A: About 15-20 years.  |
Ericsson (Ericsson)
| | Posted on Saturday, June 05, 2004 - 6:02 pm: | |
Johns, you're exactly right.
I remember walking around a guitar show about ten years ago laughing at 70's Strats. No one wanted those things cause they had some "undesirable" features. Since then it's become impossible to get the more desirable Strats so even the 70's models move quickly at prices once thought outrageous.
The list of examples grows with time, the Gibson Melody Maker, old Epiphone Crestwoods, etc. With time almost all these things will be collectable! It's your guitar so do what you want with it but just think twice before you make an irreversible modification. |
Munch (Munch)
| | Posted on Saturday, June 05, 2004 - 7:31 pm: | |
If your concern is "will I sell this guitar?" then I'd suggest you don't refinish. However, if you're like me and like perfect looking guitars and don't intend selling them, then why not?
Just remember, the refinish must be highly professional, like my dad did on this one:
Cheers,
Mark |
Munch (Munch)
| | Posted on Saturday, June 05, 2004 - 7:32 pm: | |
If your concern is "will I sell this guitar?" then I'd suggest you don't refinish. However, if you're like me and like perfect looking guitars and don't intend selling them, then why not?
Just remember, the refinish must be highly professional, like my dad did on this one:
Cheers,
Mark |
Funkle (Funkle)
| | Posted on Sunday, June 06, 2004 - 12:30 pm: | |
Munch,
Looks awesome.
Out of curiosity, what made you decide to paint a solid color over that flamed maple top?
-Sven |
Munch (Munch)
| | Posted on Tuesday, June 08, 2004 - 10:42 pm: | |
Hi Sven,
The guitar was originally black from the factory. I was quite surprised to see that flame under the finish myself. I thought about finishing it in a black translucent burst like the Gibson Joe Perry model, but then common sense kicked in.
Cheers,
Mark |
Jim_Donahue (Jim_Donahue)
| | Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 - 11:01 pm: | |
Damn, That is amazing, Sure there's no Photoshop in there? If not, can I hire him full time to do my paint work? |
Johns (Johns)
| | Posted on Thursday, June 17, 2004 - 9:06 am: | |
Jim:
While you're here, what do you think of the high end Performers? The 400 seems like it should have competed head to head with a "real" LP of the day. Do you know why they went away so quickly?
Munch's restore does make you salivate, huh. Have you seen the pictures of the custom archtops his dad makes? Beautiful stuff. He's even posted pix of George Benson playing them. |
Jim_Donahue (Jim_Donahue)
| | Posted on Wednesday, June 30, 2004 - 11:40 pm: | |
There was a big backlash against Japanese guitars after the late 1970's. The dealers loved the copies but would not stock the copy styles like the PF, Plus I think they messed up many features on the PF like Ash bodies and hollow chambers,
Rememeber we are talking Peter Frampton, Led Zepplin and Aerosmith. Also John Travolta can't forget him. Then Van Halen hit and the Super Strat was Born. It was just bad timing and not really the right model mix.
Jim Donahue |
Spiro (Spiro)
| | Posted on Thursday, July 01, 2004 - 2:14 am: | |
here's another black beauty that has covered a nice quilted maple top...
It is an Ibanez SZ320
 |
Munch (Munch)
| | Posted on Thursday, July 01, 2004 - 5:57 pm: | |
Hi Jim,
No photoshop. Just great lighting and a very professional photographer.
Interesting that you mention ash bodies on PF's. They're credited as mahoghany in the catalogs, and mine certainly was mahoghany, although made from about 20 laminated square section strips!
Cheers,
Mark |
Spiro (Spiro)
| | Posted on Thursday, August 19, 2004 - 3:29 am: | |
 |
Spiro (Spiro)
| | Posted on Thursday, August 19, 2004 - 3:44 am: | |
 |
Johns (Johns)
| | Posted on Thursday, August 19, 2004 - 10:49 am: | |
Spiro are these last two pictures the finshed version of the stripped SZ320 you show above? If so, how did you change the dot markers to the flame inlay? |
Ericibanez (Ericibanez)
| | Posted on Thursday, August 19, 2004 - 2:44 pm: | |
Spiro,
Nice refin job! Very pretty. |
Spiro (Spiro)
| | Posted on Friday, August 20, 2004 - 1:05 am: | |
nah sorry they are not
the post looks like it went weird on me...
It was meant to show
thats my Hand picked SZ520 from Australis (thanks Cameron) with all the electronics and plastic hardware replaced...
The refin on the black is on hold at the mo..
(too many other customer repairs to do first)..
This more a reference point.. The SZ320 is now getting new frets and binding on the neck and possibly a 2674 type inlay on it or even Abalone binding.. Lets see how we go.. |
Ibnzplyr
Username: Ibnzplyr
Registered: 03-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, December 04, 2004 - 2:09 am: | |
I'd like to turn my Roadstar 1300 TR (red) into an NT (natural transparent). Any tips on doing this-- removing the old finish and what to use for the clear coat? Any detailed guidelines would be greatly appreciated. BTW, it has some dings through the finish and I keep getting outbidded on 1300 NTs.
Thank you-- Scott |
Mr_roadstar
Username: Mr_roadstar
Registered: 06-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, December 05, 2004 - 12:57 pm: | |
Scott,
The RS1300TR is by far more rare than the NT. May I suggest continuing your quest for an NT instead of refinishing yout TR? Or perhaps a trade?
Production numbers for RS1300:
1984
BK 182
CS 115
NT 599
TR 276
Total 1172
1985
BK 207
CS 6
MS 6
NT 178
Total 397
Grand Total 1569
Steve |
Ibnzplyr
Username: Ibnzplyr
Registered: 03-2004
| | Posted on Monday, December 06, 2004 - 12:37 am: | |
Hello Steve:
I must have been momentarily insane. You are right. Also. I forgot about the red headstock!
Take care and am happy about your finding work-- Scott |
Mr_roadstar
Username: Mr_roadstar
Registered: 06-2002
| | Posted on Monday, December 06, 2004 - 3:49 am: | |
That damned headstock logo is a bitch to fake, eh?
Thanx!
Steve |
Jeffsailor
Username: Jeffsailor
Registered: 01-2004
| | Posted on Monday, December 06, 2004 - 5:22 pm: | |
Scott,
Here's one...
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=3767640384
Not sure the pups are original though..
js |
Ibnzplyr
Username: Ibnzplyr
Registered: 03-2004
| | Posted on Monday, December 06, 2004 - 8:12 pm: | |
Yes, Jeff, my friend. I saw this and wrote to the seller. He said the fret job isn't quite perfect and that he might take it off ebay. We'll see. . .
And oh yeah, Steve, my partner in Roadstardom, I can't imagine faking that headstock!
Scott |
Johns
Username: Johns
Registered: 02-2001
| | Posted on Monday, May 16, 2005 - 3:33 pm: | |
Spiro:
I should be getting a new SZ520QMGAB by next week. What are the parts that you replaced on your's? Knobs and pup surrounds?
What do you think of the stubby little pup selector switch? |
Ibanezfreak1960
Username: Ibanezfreak1960
Registered: 03-2004
| | Posted on Monday, May 16, 2005 - 4:33 pm: | |
The tuning pegs on these are short. I don't know what the purpose is for that but it is weird. |
Spiro
Username: Spiro
Registered: 02-2001
| | Posted on Monday, May 16, 2005 - 4:54 pm: | |
Hey John I have replaced the following.. will take a pic soon..
Knobs replaced with sure grip II's
Pickups surrounds replaced with cream ones.
Pickup selector switch replaced with 5 way rotary PRS style switch.
Pots replaced with High quality japanese ones.
Volume control closest to pickup has been removed and replaced with a Blue LED that I can flash with tapping the guitar on my leg..
Tuners have been replaced with MB506 Tulip tuners (will be replaced again Gotoh HAPM tuners when they come in.. Height Adjustable and locking.)
Nut has been replaced half brass half bone nut.
Jack and mounting plate has been replaced with a DPDT switching Jack (to be replaced again with with a neutrick locking jack socket)
Whole guitar has been sheilded with sheilding paint....
Frets have been filed and and edges completely rounded off ala Custom shop style fretwork..
thats about it.. |
Spiro
Username: Spiro
Registered: 02-2001
| | Posted on Monday, May 16, 2005 - 5:10 pm: | |
Sorry forgot a couple of points.. I didnt like the feel of the JPM Switch it was way too stiff..
I will be rewiring the whole guitar eventually with a standard 3 way and dual push/push Pots a sprague orange drop 0.018uf cap. For a total of 21 different combinations. |
Johns
Username: Johns
Registered: 02-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 17, 2005 - 9:53 am: | |
Spiro:
Wow, that's a lot more work than I expected to hear.
Replacing the tuners sounds doable. What does the PRS style rotary switch accomplish? Why the half & half nut replacement? Why the DPDT switching jack?
Can you explain the 3 way Dual puch/pull resulting in 21 combinations?
Do you think the top is eventually going to get worn where the strings contact it coming thru the body? |
Funkle
Username: Funkle
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 17, 2005 - 3:11 pm: | |
...and what about that blue LED that flashes by tapping the guitar on your leg?
Looks like a great guitar!
-Sven |
Ibanezfreak1960
Username: Ibanezfreak1960
Registered: 03-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 17, 2005 - 4:23 pm: | |
I would say Spiro has access to parts more than us average Ibanez lovers. My SZ720 is decent but it could use a pup change and some tone variation also. No complaints about the gibralter 3 its a great bridge. Tuning is somtimes a pain in the butt but over all Its ok. |
Spiro
Username: Spiro
Registered: 02-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 17, 2005 - 4:50 pm: | |
Hey John.
The PRS style Rotary switch gives you a 5 way split ala standard blade switch..
so you have the following combinations..
1. Bridge Hum
2. bridge neck split in phase
3. Bridge neck split out of phase
4. Neck out of phase
5. Neck Hum
But with 2 push/push pots and a 3 way toggle I get possibility of 12 diferent combinations not 21.
The half half nut was more an aesthetic thing.. I had a Bone nut originally (i always throw those plastic nuts away.) but Just like the look of the half half nut.
The string through body design is great no problems yet. I just checki the ferrules for sharp edges every 3 or 4 string changes and deburr if neccessary. The only thing I have found is that they touch the leading edge of the bridge very slightly.
The light is for stage show that I can do my own light show
there will be another 8 lights installed in the guitar during next string change.. and the DPDT switching jack (as used on active guitars) is there to turn the lights on and off when you plug the guitar in.
The tuners were a weak point for sure. the guitar tunes alot better and stays there now. Gotoh have made some great changes to their tuners in the last few years and man they should be used on every guitar.. Ask me about which models to use as there are cheapy ones as well.
Hey freak Yes I do have more access to parts than most guys because.... I need them in stock... I probably have about 20 sets of tuners in stock.. I have more parts than all the guitars stores i sydney put together..
The Other thing I would be changing ASAP is the Pots.. I would recommend some decent quality pots (CTS will do but will have to use US style Knobs on them.) I have Japanese Pots that I get specially ordered in (Identical to the old ibanez pots from the 70's and 80's)
I also Didnt like the sound of the SZ pickups they were to muddy for my liking so Installed Seymours.. Duncan Custom Custom in the bridge and a Duncan Distortion in the neck.. (impedance matched)
The reason for all the changes? Because I like to tinker. And also because it is my main Playing Axe live so I want it feeling the best looking its best and sounding its best at all times. |